Tape 9, Side 1, through Tape 10, Side 2. In the fifth interview session, conducted on November 13, 2001, Schoppert discusses the reasons for the high turnover in the bus driving profession, talks about the difficulty of convincing transit companies to promote from within, and describes how union organizing became more difficult over the 20th century. He speaks extensively about ATU International leadership and internal politics, and about negotiations he participated in across the United States. He shares his opinion about education programs for ATU members. He also talks about his health at the time of the interview.